X-Git-Url: http://unremediatedgender.space/source?p=Ultimately_Untrue_Thought.git;a=blobdiff_plain;f=content%2F2016%2Freply-to-ozy-on-two-type-mtf-taxonomy.md;h=e0effd66c339bd84c792fb66b3a318f0ad19ed60;hp=f30bf690f990f02cd79b8bd7e487f9201ad12ac1;hb=HEAD;hpb=20d93005c5958ab72bdff2fff6921855b515820b diff --git a/content/2016/reply-to-ozy-on-two-type-mtf-taxonomy.md b/content/2016/reply-to-ozy-on-two-type-mtf-taxonomy.md index f30bf69..3030631 100644 --- a/content/2016/reply-to-ozy-on-two-type-mtf-taxonomy.md +++ b/content/2016/reply-to-ozy-on-two-type-mtf-taxonomy.md @@ -1,9 +1,9 @@ Title: Reply to Ozymandias on Two-Type MtF Taxonomy Date: 2016-11-24 20:46 Category: commentary -Tags: two-type taxonomy +Tags: two-type taxonomy, Ozy -This post is a response to Ozymandias's ["Thoughts on The Blanchard/Bailey Distinction"](https://thingofthings.wordpress.com/2016/11/22/thoughts-on-the-blanchardbailey-distinction/), published on their (still highly recommended!) blog, [_Thing of Things_](https://thingofthings.wordpress.com/). +This post is a response to Ozymandias's ["Thoughts on The Blanchard/Bailey Distinction"](https://thingofthings.wordpress.com/2016/11/22/thoughts-on-the-blanchardbailey-distinction/) (and is [cross-posted to the comments](https://thingofthings.wordpress.com/2016/11/22/thoughts-on-the-blanchardbailey-distinction/comment-page-1/#comment-23088) there). > Autogynephilia does not work like other sexual fetishes. It is relatively rare for a person to upend their entire life to satisfy a sexual fetish @@ -23,7 +23,7 @@ There actually are some accounts of this! See the "Effects of Hormone Therapy" s > Second of all, it is strange that autogynephilia is the only erotic target location error that causes a significant number of people to wish to transition. There are maybe some people with bodily identity integrity disorder (although far fewer than gender dysphorics) and maybe some otherkin. -Yes, we expect there to be a lot more autogynephilic trans women than aspiring amputees or otherkin, because attraction to women (that is, standard male sexuality) is much more common than attraction to amputees or animals. +Yes, we expect there to be a lot more autogynephilic trans women than aspiring amputees or otherkin, because attraction to women (that is, standard male sexuality) is vastly more common than attraction to amputees or animals. > Furthermore, the autogynephilia theory does not even explain the data it purports to explain. Why are trans women disproportionately engineers and soldiers, instead of being randomly sampled from the male population? @@ -33,11 +33,11 @@ As it happens, I don't think autogynephilia and associated gender dysphoria are > Why would a fetish make one transition later? -It's not so much that autogynephiles _can't_ transition early—like you say, you know a lot who did so at 19 or 20 (of whom I am _so jealous_)—but more that the nature of their condition is such that deciding to pull the trigger and just do it after many long years of slowly building up a female gender identity through crossdressing and fantasy is something that makes sense, whereas the for androphilic-feminine type, if you make it to age 30 as a feminine gay man, there's little incentive to not just stay that way. +It's not so much that autogynephiles _can't_ transition early—like you say, you know a lot who did so at 19 or 20 (of whom I am _so jealous_)—but more that the nature of their condition is such that deciding to pull the trigger and just do it after many long years of slowly building up a female gender identity through crossdressing and fantasy is something that makes sense, whereas for the androphilic-feminine type, if you make it to age 30 as a feminine gay man, there's little incentive to not just stay that way. > Why would it cause one to not pass as well? Surely fetishizing being an attractive woman would cause one to have a lot of motivation to be an attractive woman. -Part of it is going to be age of transition, as you note. Another part is that there's lot of subtly gendered behavioral stuff that we _don't know how to fix_ independently of _motivation_, things you might not _notice_ as part of the female-typical phenotype until you meet an autogynephilic trans woman who doesn't have them. [Motor behaviors](https://sillyolme.wordpress.com/2010/09/24/all-the-wrong-moves/). [Vocal mannerisms](https://sillyolme.wordpress.com/2012/12/01/the-sound-of-your-voice/). Unfortunately (heartbreakingly), this is a [harder problem than people realize](http://lesswrong.com/lw/xe/changing_emotions/)! +Part of it is going to be age of transition, as you note. Another part is that there's lot of subtly gendered behavioral stuff that we _don't know how to fix_ independently of _motivation_, things you might not _notice_ as part of the female-typical phenotype until you meet an autogynephilic trans woman who doesn't have them. [Motor behaviors](https://sillyolme.wordpress.com/2010/09/24/all-the-wrong-moves/). [Vocal mannerisms](https://sillyolme.wordpress.com/2012/12/01/the-sound-of-your-voice/). Unfortunately (heartbreakingly), this is a [hard problem](https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/QZs4vkC7cbyjL9XA9/changing-emotions)—harder than people realize! > the idea that very feminine gay men transition because gay men are attracted to masculine men and straight men are attracted to feminine women, so by becoming a woman they can get a more desirable sexual partner