X-Git-Url: http://unremediatedgender.space/source?p=Ultimately_Untrue_Thought.git;a=blobdiff_plain;f=notes%2Fsexual-dimorphism-in-the-sequences-notes.md;h=711dc60ed12a973d3ad4cce818eb699c9956873e;hp=933173c4dff4bd17b98a5b23fef76552ae03d5d6;hb=222f3221c86ff7a64a0ab7fd6b5a904a7c0a594c;hpb=a5a7b08178cf7e40ce76ac49b8c4a9ec56bab474 diff --git a/notes/sexual-dimorphism-in-the-sequences-notes.md b/notes/sexual-dimorphism-in-the-sequences-notes.md index 933173c..711dc60 100644 --- a/notes/sexual-dimorphism-in-the-sequences-notes.md +++ b/notes/sexual-dimorphism-in-the-sequences-notes.md @@ -1,32 +1,76 @@ -Incidents to Include— +Marketing— -Done(ish)— -✓ "Failed Utopia 4-2" -✓ "Changing Emotions" +To LW— -Easy— -* love of a man for a woman, and vice versa as separate fragments of value -* Psychological Unity of Humankind is only up to sex +_(content warning sexism)_ +_(content warning transphobia)_ +_(content warning too much information about weird fetishes)_ +_(content warning WTF did I just read)_ + +(November 2020, [TODO] words) + +---- + +On Twitter— + +WTF transphobic garbage did I just read?? Too bad Yudkowsky can't control how creepy randos on the internet interpret his work ... + +----- +To SneerClub— + +Hi SneerClub! I noticed that you've enjoyed some of my [previous](https://www.reddit.com/r/SneerClub/comments/fw9cng/the_lgbt_activist_machinery_instead_adapted/) [work](https://www.reddit.com/r/SneerClub/comments/61t94y/rationalist_tries_justifying_their_transphobia_by/), so I thought I would go ahead and proactively share this one with you, because (I'm guessing) it probably checks a lot of the boxes for top sneerable content: it's got Yudkowsky hero-worship, _and_ sexism (as many of you would define that), _and_ transphobia (as many of you would define that), _and_ weird sex stuff! + +(From _my_ perspective, I'm pouring my heart out about the most important thing in my life, but if someone else with a different perspective would only sneer, then I can only hope to have been—if only for a moment, as part of a subroutine in the optimal sneer computation—_understood_. And for that moment, I am grateful.) + +---- + +B.F. on JKR (https://www.facebook.com/duncan.sabien/posts/3883966591638029?comment_id=3884054068295948&reply_comment_id=3884243454943676): +> I am very glad that I don't have anyone with opinions similar to hers in my immediate vicinity, because I am pretty sure that if I did, my brain would constantly be running a scared loop in any social interactions with them. [...] I think it's important that people can write essays that are as far outside my personal Overton window as hers is outside it (because sometimes they're correct and I should update, even though I don't believe this is an instance of that) + +Duncan's voicing my concern: https://www.facebook.com/duncan.sabien/posts/3890320517669303 + +----- +Points to work in— * Superhappies empathic inference for not wanting to believe girls were different +https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/qCsxiojX7BSLuuBgQ/the-super-happy-people-3-8 * "The Opposite Sex" https://web.archive.org/web/20130216025508/http://lesswrong.com/lw/rp/the_opposite_sex/ * EY was right about "men need to think about themselves _as men_" (find cite) * Vassar slapping me down * "Mr. Davis" -* I'm not actually very good at first-person visualization, which demonstrates something -* study evidence that this is actually common -* AGPs dating each other is the analogue of "Failed Utopia 4-2"!! - - -Harder— * Faster Than Science, Transgender Edition (prior draft) * "I often wish some men/women would appreciate" * empathic inference: https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/NLMo5FZWFFq652MNe/sympathetic-minds https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/Zkzzjg3h7hW5Z36hK/humans-in-funny-suits https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/9fpWoXpNv83BAHJdc/the-comedy-of-behaviorism +* study evidence that this is actually common +* AGPs dating each other is the analogue of "Failed Utopia 4-2"!!—the guys in "Conservative Men in Conservative Dresses" are doing better in some ways * wipe culturally defined values * finding things in the refrigerator * https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/FBgozHEv7J72NCEPB/my-way https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/xsyG7PkMekHud2DMK/of-gender-and-rationality +* make sure the late-onset/AGP terminology is introduced in a coherent order rather than being inserted willy-nilly +* the message length of my existence +----- +Outline for remaining Coda— + * you can doubt someone's theory without doubting their report-as-data + * what "as a first approximation" means in causal graphs + * people have a political incentive to deny, but I'm making a fact-claim + * I would have expected the "rationalists" to be interested in getting the right answer (quote the "20% of the ones with penises" Facebook post), but it doesn't look like that's happening + +people colluding to maintain a thin layer of social constructions; lies to cis people + +[sympathetic minds gay couples anecdote] +Anne Lawrence described autogynephiles as ["men who love women and want to become what they love."](/papers/lawrence-becoming_what_we_love.pdf) But it's worse than that. We're men who love what we _wish_ women were, and want to become _that_. + +[I have seen the destiny of my neurotype, and am putting forth a convulsive effort to wrench it off its path. My weapon is clear writing.](https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/i8q4vXestDkGTFwsc/human-evil-and-muddled-thinking) + + +----- + +"different thing that I don't understand" /2019/Jan/interlude-xvi/ + + +Be careful to phrase the early part as about _me_, and only point fingers at trans women in the coda My ideological committment to psychological-sex-differences denialism made me uncomfortable when the topic of sex differences happened to come up on the blog—which wasn't particularly often, but in such a vast, sprawling body of work as the Sequences, it occasionally turned out to be relevant in a discussion of evolution or human values. @@ -58,7 +102,6 @@ learned things in the wrong order Anyway, I kind of spent the next ten years reading everything I could about sex and gender and transgender and feminism and evopsych and doing various things with my social presentation—sometimes things I regretted and reverted after a lot of pain—to try to seem not-masculine, - all the while assuming that my gender problems were clearly not the same thing as the gender problems of actual trans women, because the standard narrative was that that's @@ -82,19 +125,8 @@ writes down all the facts that aren't on anyone's side. ----- -_(content warning sexism)_ -_(content warning transphobia)_ -_(content warning too much information about weird fetishes)_ -_(content warning WTF did I just read)_ - -(October 2020, [TODO] words) - ------ -Hi SneerClub! I noticed that you've enjoyed some of my [previous](https://www.reddit.com/r/SneerClub/comments/fw9cng/the_lgbt_activist_machinery_instead_adapted/) [work](https://www.reddit.com/r/SneerClub/comments/61t94y/rationalist_tries_justifying_their_transphobia_by/), so I thought I would go ahead and proactively share this one with you, because (I'm guessing) it probably checks a lot of the boxes for top sneerable content: it's got Yudkowsky hero-worship, _and_ sexism (as many of you would define that), _and_ transphobia (as many of you would define that), _and_ weird sex stuff! - -(From _my_ perspective, I'm pouring my heart out about the most important thing in my life, but if someone else with a different perspective would only sneer, then I can only hope to have been—if only for a moment, as part of a subroutine in the optimal sneer computation—_understood_. And for that moment, I am grateful.) Sometimes I sigh because I'll never get rich @@ -112,10 +144,6 @@ Just 'cause I'm butch and I'm a tranny girl -[sympathetic minds gay couples anecdote] -Anne Lawrence described autogynephiles as ["men who love women and want to become what they love."](/papers/lawrence-becoming_what_we_love.pdf) But it's worse than that. We're men who love what we _wish_ women were, and want to become _that_. - -[I have seen the destiny of my neurotype, and am putting forth a convulsive effort to wrench it off its path. My weapon is clear writing.](https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/i8q4vXestDkGTFwsc/human-evil-and-muddled-thinking) https://archive.is/7Wolo > the massive correlation between exposure to Yudkowsky’s writings and being a trans woman (can’t bother to do the calculations but the connection is absurdly strong) @@ -145,33 +173,81 @@ people like me being incentivized to identify as part of a political pressure gr [TODO: are we getting new recruits? A lot of the names I see are old] - Yudkowsky says trans rights! +This doesn't pass the smell test. This doesn't pass the _laugh_ test. https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/jMTbQj9XB5ah2maup/similarity-clusters https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/cFzC996D7Jjds3vS9/arguing-by-definition +https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/mB95aqTSJLNR9YyjH/message-length + https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/9QxnfMYccz9QRgZ5z/the-costly-coordination-mechanism-of-common-knowledge +https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/L22jhyY9ocXQNLqyE/science-as-curiosity-stopper + +Personal identity— +https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/MkKcnPdTZ3pQ9F5yC/cryonics-without-freezers-resurrection-possibilities-in-a +https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/hJPh8XyJ3fTK2hLFJ/three-dialogues-on-identity + +"I'm not from around here; I'm from another dimension" + +activity group selecting on T ... + +But the angle between the line between me and my sister, and the line between me and my female analogue, is the [arctangent](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverse_trigonometric_functions) of the difference-between-same-sex-siblings and the difference-between-sexes, which is small if sex differences are a lot larger than same-sex sibling differences (with respect to whatever metric on personspace we're using). + +[the direction of causality](http://zackmdavis.net/blog/2016/07/concerns/) +http://zackmdavis.net/blog/2016/09/concerns-ii/ + +address GI->AGP direction + +(The scintillating but ultimately untrue thought.) + +Fit in somewhere— +https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/KmghfjH6RgXvoKruJ/hand-vs-fingers + +I'm not objecting to your existence, I'm only objecting to the prerequisites to your existence + + +(See Tailcalled on "zooming in" on the typology to at least a four node graph.) + +But once you stop taking the "gender identity"/"woman trapped in a man's body" story as _axiom_ and + + +It's possible to disagree with people's _theoretical account_ of their own psychology, without doubting the honesty of their self-report, in the sense that people are doing their best to translate the ineffable _qualia_ of their experience into words. + +[throw a chair](/2019/Jan/use-it-or-lose-it/) and yell, "How dumb do you think we are?!" + +The claim is not that the trans woman who describes her experience as an "internal sense of her own gender" is lying. + +If someone claims to have an inter + +https://surveyanon.wordpress.com/2019/10/27/the-mathematical-consequences-of-a-toy-model-of-gender-transition/ + +You might ask, what do I mean by "as a first approximation"? + +/2018/Jan/dont-negotiate-with-terrorist-memeplexes/#a-thing-about-me + +_You have to let me show you what you are_. + +> The absolute inadequacy of every single institution in the civilization of magical Britain is what happened! You cannot comprehend it, boy! I cannot comprehend it! It has to be seen and even then it cannot be believed! +http://www.hpmor.com/chapter/108 + +> The realization blasted through Harry like a vast dam breaking, releasing out all its water, bursting through his mind in an irresistible flood that swept everything away. +> There is only one reality that generates all of the observations. -as demonstrated by the likes of [FaceApp](https://www.faceapp.com/), the _uniquely best piece of software in the world_. +(http://www.hpmor.com/chapter/104) -(Note that we can already basically do this for _images_ of female and male faces, using the [latent spaces found by generative adversarial networks]() and [autoencoders](), +It's not a gender identity; it's a sexual orientation that's surprisingly easy to misinterpret as a gender identity -Doing it for _actual whole people in the real world_ and not just flat images is a task for future superintelligences, not present-day GANs, but some of same basic principles should apply.) +The level above "Many-worlds is obviously correct, stop being stupid" is "Racial IQ differences are obviously real; stop being stupid" -[TODO: Mathematically, -Joel et al. and response—maybe in next paragraph -Beyond the Binary: https://www.pnas.org/content/112/50/15468 -http://cogprints.org/10046/1/Delgiudice_etal_critique_joel_2015.pdf +https://slatestarcodex.com/2017/03/24/guided-by-the-beauty-of-our-weapons/ +my pseudobisexual moments -> once you draw a boundary around a group, the mind starts trying to harvest similarities from the group. And unfortunately the human pattern-detectors seem to operate in such overdrive that we see patterns whether they're there or not; a weakly negative correlation can be mistaken for a strong positive one with a bit of selective memory. -https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/veN86cBhoe7mBxXLk/categorizing-has-consequences +Anyway, four years later, it turns out that this whole "rationality" subculture is completely fake. The thing that convinced me of this was not _even_ the late-onset-gender-dysphoria-in-males-is-not-an-intersex-condition thesis that I was originally trying to talk about. Humans are _really complicated_: no matter how "obvious" something in psychology or social science to me, I can't write someone off entirely simply for disagreeing, because the whole domain is so complex that I always have to acknowledge that, ultimately, I could just be wrong. -96.8% classification from MRI https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6374327/ -] -[the wrists: http://unremediatedgender.space/papers/yune_et_al-beyond_human_perception_sexual_dimorphism_in_hand_and_wrist_radiographs.pdf] +But in the _process_ of trying to _talk about_ this late-onset-gender-dysphoria-in-males-is-not-an-intersex-condition thesis, I noticed that my conversations kept getting _derailed_ on some variation of "The word _woman_ doesn't necessarily mean that." _That_ part of the debate, I knew I could win. -Face editing with Generative Adversarial Networks: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCKbRCUyop8 \ No newline at end of file +[dark side epistemology, what the math actually means in the real world from "Reply to Holden"]